Post by dmitry on Dec 12, 2015 21:00:58 GMT
But back to my original question which I agree was one there can’t be a clear answer too because it’s purely hypothetical.
Now had Islam never arisen its likely that the old Mediterranean economic and cultural system would have been reviewed? After all the eastern romans (who only became fully Hellenized as a reaction to the Islamic invasion and the subsequent militarization and simplification of society) would have kept a large part of the Mediterranean, including Syria, Egypt and North Africa. Also being defeated and in a crisis with a growing Christian influence Persia might have converted to Christianity (or might have just split into several states).
Now without Islam the Mediterranean sea would have remained a cohesive economic unit thus one could expect a quicker revival of the western economy, then again the Byzantines might have grown stronger and tried to reestablish the roman empire and they would probably have failed (except maybe in Italy but they would have never reconquered Gaul let alone Britannia). Now the question remains how this would have impacted the development of western science?
First the positives: the west would have had much greater contact with the Mediterranean were much knowledge was there to be used, initially booth economy and ancient knowledge would have been in a better situation then it was in real history but....
The west might have "caught" the culture of the eastern roman empire and developed less independently as it did when it was mostly cut off from the (then massively crippled) Byzantines, thus western culture might not have developed in the way that led it to modernity and creating 90% of the worlds knowledge and technology. Also had the eastern empire faced an economic revival it might have become more productive in terms of science but it might also have been as stagnant as it was under Anastasias-Justinian (when it was still relatively well off). Christianity would also have spread deeper into Africa and "Christendom" would be a far broader category then it became after Islam (basically being the religion of Europe/whites with what remained of it elsewhere being subservient dhimmis and isolated kingdoms in Africa fighting off the Muslims), to be honest I have no idea what cultural influence this would have had.
Islam did create a bridge between east and west and transferred important things (mostly Hindu mathematics and Paper) to the west. While Hindu numerals were already introduced in Persia before the Islamic conquests and would probably have "migrated" to Christian Syria I find it difficult to imagine how paper would have come west without the Muslims (this would have been counterbalanced by the fact that the course of Papyrus would still have been in Christian hands but cheap paper is still superior to that). I guess it could have come west via the Nestorian Christian trade network, or if the Persians would have turned Christian.
Now there is also the idea that Islam did make great contributions to science that wouldn’t have been made without it which might have set the scientific revolution back a few decades (I doubt its centuries since I believe that once modern science is developed and there is a specific culture that keeps it going, things that the Muslims achieved in 500 years could be achieved in 50 (after all after 1800 science and technology advanced every 10 years about the same as it did every 100 years in the time around 1000)
Now had Islam never arisen its likely that the old Mediterranean economic and cultural system would have been reviewed? After all the eastern romans (who only became fully Hellenized as a reaction to the Islamic invasion and the subsequent militarization and simplification of society) would have kept a large part of the Mediterranean, including Syria, Egypt and North Africa. Also being defeated and in a crisis with a growing Christian influence Persia might have converted to Christianity (or might have just split into several states).
Now without Islam the Mediterranean sea would have remained a cohesive economic unit thus one could expect a quicker revival of the western economy, then again the Byzantines might have grown stronger and tried to reestablish the roman empire and they would probably have failed (except maybe in Italy but they would have never reconquered Gaul let alone Britannia). Now the question remains how this would have impacted the development of western science?
First the positives: the west would have had much greater contact with the Mediterranean were much knowledge was there to be used, initially booth economy and ancient knowledge would have been in a better situation then it was in real history but....
The west might have "caught" the culture of the eastern roman empire and developed less independently as it did when it was mostly cut off from the (then massively crippled) Byzantines, thus western culture might not have developed in the way that led it to modernity and creating 90% of the worlds knowledge and technology. Also had the eastern empire faced an economic revival it might have become more productive in terms of science but it might also have been as stagnant as it was under Anastasias-Justinian (when it was still relatively well off). Christianity would also have spread deeper into Africa and "Christendom" would be a far broader category then it became after Islam (basically being the religion of Europe/whites with what remained of it elsewhere being subservient dhimmis and isolated kingdoms in Africa fighting off the Muslims), to be honest I have no idea what cultural influence this would have had.
Islam did create a bridge between east and west and transferred important things (mostly Hindu mathematics and Paper) to the west. While Hindu numerals were already introduced in Persia before the Islamic conquests and would probably have "migrated" to Christian Syria I find it difficult to imagine how paper would have come west without the Muslims (this would have been counterbalanced by the fact that the course of Papyrus would still have been in Christian hands but cheap paper is still superior to that). I guess it could have come west via the Nestorian Christian trade network, or if the Persians would have turned Christian.
Now there is also the idea that Islam did make great contributions to science that wouldn’t have been made without it which might have set the scientific revolution back a few decades (I doubt its centuries since I believe that once modern science is developed and there is a specific culture that keeps it going, things that the Muslims achieved in 500 years could be achieved in 50 (after all after 1800 science and technology advanced every 10 years about the same as it did every 100 years in the time around 1000)